Onyx wrote:

Shimmerskin wrote: And that watchfulness...it also reminds me of Peter in the Garden when Jesus commands him to watch through the night. And what is Jesus doing while Peter is watching/on watch? He is praying...which is like meditating...which is like a trancelike state...which is sort of like sleeping.... Didn't Peter fall asleep? I kind of figured that Edward would be the Christ-figure in that scene because, as Jesus was praying/meditating on redeeming the world, Edward always seems to be thinking about keeping Bella safe & human. Just a thought.

Oh, fine, if you want to be LITERAL about it! I should have said, "...while Peter is supposed to be watching..."

Given your apt description, I think it's possible to look at Edward as being in both positions.

Besides which, I have a little fantasy that Edward watching Bella sleep sometimes induces a deep meditative state in him, the closest he can ever get to actual, blessed sleep and one of the reasons I love the idea of him being with her throught the night. So in that sense, Edward falls "asleep" watching, or at least goes into a sort of trance. But that's just my fantasy. YMMV.

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Shimmerskin wrote:

Besides which, I have a little fantasy that Edward watching Bella sleep sometimes induces a deep meditative state in him, the closest he can ever get to actual, blessed sleep and one of the reasons I love the idea of him being with her throught the night. So in that sense, Edward falls "asleep" watching, or at least goes into a sort of trance. But that's just my fantasy. YMMV.

My thoughts exactly Jaime; I referred to it as the closest Edward get to "living human".

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"Children are the anchors of a mother's life"-Sophocles


"You are my life now" Twilight page 314

Shimmerskin wrote:

Onyx wrote: Shimmerskin wrote: And that watchfulness...it also reminds me of Peter in the Garden when Jesus commands him to watch through the night. And what is Jesus doing while Peter is watching/on watch? He is praying...which is like meditating...which is like a trancelike state...which is sort of like sleeping.... Didn't Peter fall asleep? I kind of figured that Edward would be the Christ-figure in that scene because, as Jesus was praying/meditating on redeeming the world, Edward always seems to be thinking about keeping Bella safe & human. Just a thought. Oh, fine, if you want to be LITERAL about it! I should have said, "...while Peter is supposed to be watching..." Given your apt description, I think it's possible to look at Edward as being in both positions. Besides which, I have a little fantasy that Edward watching Bella sleep sometimes induces a deep meditative state in him, the closest he can ever get to actual, blessed sleep and one of the reasons I love the idea of him being with her throught the night. So in that sense, Edward falls "asleep" watching, or at least goes into a sort of trance. But that's just my fantasy. YMMV.

I think you're right too, though. The ability each of them has to be both savior for and saved by the other is one of the things that makes their relationship so very compelling.

Oh, and what does "YMMV" mean?

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Pluckie for President!!!!

Onyx wrote:

Shimmerskin wrote: Onyx wrote: Shimmerskin wrote: And that watchfulness...it also reminds me of Peter in the Garden when Jesus commands him to watch through the night. And what is Jesus doing while Peter is watching/on watch? He is praying...which is like meditating...which is like a trancelike state...which is sort of like sleeping.... Didn't Peter fall asleep? I kind of figured that Edward would be the Christ-figure in that scene because, as Jesus was praying/meditating on redeeming the world, Edward always seems to be thinking about keeping Bella safe & human. Just a thought. Oh, fine, if you want to be LITERAL about it! I should have said, "...while Peter is supposed to be watching..." Given your apt description, I think it's possible to look at Edward as being in both positions. Besides which, I have a little fantasy that Edward watching Bella sleep sometimes induces a deep meditative state in him, the closest he can ever get to actual, blessed sleep and one of the reasons I love the idea of him being with her throught the night. So in that sense, Edward falls "asleep" watching, or at least goes into a sort of trance. But that's just my fantasy. YMMV. I think you're right too, though. The ability each of them has to be both savior for and saved by the other is one of the things that makes their relationship so very compelling. Oh, and what does "YMMV" mean?

Your mileage may vary-- meaning others may have a different opinion

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"How could there not be more for one such as Edward?"

I've never thought of Edward as a Christ-like figure. I've thought of him as a terrifying angel though. Angels are fierce, but loving at the same time, and that's always the picture that I get (maybe because Bella is always saying he has the face of an angel?). Although, Edward would gladly lay down his life for Bella, which is the greatest love any person can show. Isn't that what Christ did? I suppose Edward is God-like, also, in the way that he knows what others around him are thinking. Plus, he's always looking out and protecting the people he loves (even in Bella's sleep). I will have to picture him as more of a god than an angel the next time I read it.

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"Edward, there's no point to forever without you. I wouldn't want one day without you."
Edward is my ride!

I have the feeling everyone will hate me for this, but I got REALLY tired of hearing Edward described as an angel. After the 50th time, I wanted to shout, "Okay, I get it already! You've made your point. He's powerful but not evil."

But Edward watching Bella sleep in the later parts of the books could probably be equivilant to a guardian angel. He's watching over her, and protecting her then, as opposed to the beginning where I think he's just frustrated because he can't hear her thoughts, and curious, and eavesdropping on her sleep talking. I concede that.

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Volunteers do not get paid...not because they are worthless, but because they are priceless.

I love that Bella has her breath taken away every time she looks at Edward. I have to admit it made me "look" at my husband again. He still takes my breath away after 14 years.

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Marye~

auntie venom wrote:

Onyx wrote: Oh, and what does "YMMV" mean? Your mileage may vary-- meaning others may have a different opinion

Thanks, auntie! Long time no see. How have you been?


Jayne1955, I'm on your side on this one. I got kind of irritated with constant angel comparison thing. But now I'm wondering if perhaps I sort of misunderstood the point of that. Biblical angels (OT in particular) are not your grandmother's angels. Maybe SM didn't mean beautiful in the nineteenth century angel way, but rather in the beautiful-terrible-mesmerizing-scary-tall-eyes-of-flame biblical way...

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Pluckie for President!!!!

Onyx
You're right. No one said he was a Saint. There are so many types of angels, such as angels of vengeance(Edward vs. James/Victoria), messengers (Alice), calm hand of God (Jasper), God's beauty (Rosalie), God's strength (Emmitt), God's mercy (Carlisle), and God's parenting (Esme). But when Bella's sleeping, Edward is her guardian angel. And I agree with a previous post that he has filled that post for many others. It's the whole Stregoni Benefici thing....

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Lauralee

lauralee wrote:

Onyx You're right. No one said he was a Saint. There are so many types of angels, such as angels of vengeance(Edward vs. James/Victoria), messengers (Alice), calm hand of God (Jasper), God's beauty (Rosalie), God's strength (Emmitt), God's mercy (Carlisle), and God's parenting (Esme). But when Bella's sleeping, Edward is her guardian angel. And I agree with a previous post that he has filled that post for many others. It's the whole Stregoni Benefici thing....

Wonderful analogy! I was having a hard time with the god/angel concept but I love your perspective.

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Marye~

lauralee wrote:

Onyx You're right. No one said he was a Saint. There are so many types of angels, such as angels of vengeance(Edward vs. James/Victoria), messengers (Alice), calm hand of God (Jasper), God's beauty (Rosalie), God's strength (Emmitt), God's mercy (Carlisle), and God's parenting (Esme). But when Bella's sleeping, Edward is her guardian angel. And I agree with a previous post that he has filled that post for many others. It's the whole Stregoni Benefici thing....

I love that! I kept trying to get that thought into words but couldn't do it. You worded that perfectly for me!

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"Edward, there's no point to forever without you. I wouldn't want one day without you."
Edward is my ride!

muspia15 wrote:

lauralee wrote: Onyx You're right. No one said he was a Saint. There are so many types of angels, such as angels of vengeance(Edward vs. James/Victoria), messengers (Alice), calm hand of God (Jasper), God's beauty (Rosalie), God's strength (Emmitt), God's mercy (Carlisle), and God's parenting (Esme). But when Bella's sleeping, Edward is her guardian angel. And I agree with a previous post that he has filled that post for many others. It's the whole Stregoni Benefici thing.... I love that! I kept trying to get that thought into words but couldn't do it. You worded that perfectly for me!

And don't they watch as we sleep...

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"I didn't want to be the monster! I didn't want to kill this room full of harmless children! I didn't want to lose everything I'd gained
in a lifetime of sacrifice and denial!
I wouldn't! She couldn't make me.
*EDWARD-Midnight Sun*

I too, thought it was incredibly sweet and wonderful that Edward was so drawn to Bella that he could spend hours just watching her sleep and dream...and listening for her to say his name.

However...If I were Bella, I would be horrified. I'd be completely embarrassed and wondering if I had snored or drooled or anything else terribly unladylike while he was watching. If it were me, I'd probably have forbidden him to do it again, despite how sweet it is.

(I'm crazy self-conscious though...)

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Lily wrote:

I too, thought it was incredibly sweet and wonderful that Edward was so drawn to Bella that he could spend hours just watching her sleep and dream...and listening for her to say his name. However...If I were Bella, I would be horrified. I'd be completely embarrassed and wondering if I had snored or drooled or anything else terribly unladylike while he was watching. If it were me, I'd probably have forbidden him to do it again, despite how sweet it is. (I'm crazy self-conscious though...)

Bella was definitely mortified when she first found out! However, she seems to have been more concerned about what she might have revealed while talking in her sleep than whether she'd had any embarrassing "human moments" (snorting, drooling, stinking, or having her shirt ride up....)

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"Bella was definitely mortified when she first found out! However, she seems to have been more concerned about what she might have revealed while talking in her sleep than whether she'd had any embarrassing "human moments" (snorting, drooling, stinking, or having her shirt ride up....)'

SHIMMER, YOU ARE TOO FUNNY!!!

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"I didn't want to be the monster! I didn't want to kill this room full of harmless children! I didn't want to lose everything I'd gained
in a lifetime of sacrifice and denial!
I wouldn't! She couldn't make me.
*EDWARD-Midnight Sun*